i.e. “I need Olanzapine [broad receptor affinity, highly anti-cholinergic, well-tolerated], but, like, faster.” I’m surprised that particular aspect of the side effect profile comes into play with acute usage.
I’m unsure if you don’t work inpatient psychiatry or you just work somewhere significantly classier than I do.
Ah, yes, this happens a lot. No, I don’t work in the medical field at all. I just know things, for reasons.
I do work in an inner city area that’s flush with people stuck in a cycle of drugs / homelessness
i.e. the psychosis has done so much cumulative damage at this point that you need to fall back to the typicals. That explains why the third-gens are useless.
On a different note, have you heard about Cobenfy yet?
It obviously isn’t suited to the needs of your practice. But I’m really glad we’re making progress on alternative treatment approaches, especially novel ones like anti-muscarinics.
Hopefully the new glutamatergics can reach your setting soon.
I’m surprised that particular aspect of the side effect profile comes into play with acute usage.
Well obvs. It’s basically,“idk which receptor is making them _____ (punch people, refuse to eat or drink, or whatever other immediate harm to themselves / others), but we need it to stop 3 days ago and can figure out the details or a potential cross-taper to something better later.”
Ah, yes, this happens a lot. No, I don’t work in the medical field at all. I just know things, for reasons.
Color me fascinated, lol. My guesses are personal experience / reading up on your own treatment or that of a loved one, tangential relation to the field such as clinical research, or just plain personal fascination. Given you linked to a drug that appears to be in trials my first guess is actually the second one. Hadn’t heard of it, and I’m hopeful, but after seeing abilify get approved for acute agitation I’m… skeptical.
i.e. the psychosis has done so much cumulative damage at this point that you need to fall back to the typicals. That explains why the third-gens are useless.
Yeah a lot of people don’t realize the damage is additive, both people w/ these disorders and unrelated laypeople who think “talented artist stops taking their meds and continues to be talented but starts creating art with weirder subject matter as their brain boils” is a cool story.
I’m mostly replying to add though that risperdal also has the distinction of being avaliable as a long-acting injectable, and if you’re trialing oral meds before committing to an LAI, your options are somewhat narrowed. Zyprexa does have an LAI available, but I’ve actually never seen it used and while I can’t tell you why for certain, I do have a guess.
If you have a patient sick enough that you’re considering an LAI, you don’t want to take benzos off the table for an entire month, especially if it turns out to be inadequate after discharge and they wind up in an ED agitated and unable to report their own med hx and get B52ed and stop breathing. I’ve had a pharmacist tell me considering that interaction is going out of style but a history of that kind of adverse event is difficult for a med to shake. Accutane still has suicidal ideation in adolescents listed as a side effect but I have a strong suspicion that it’s less causation and more correlation with the impact of pizza face on the self and social esteem of a teenager.
Acute care, understood.
i.e. “I need Olanzapine [broad receptor affinity, highly anti-cholinergic, well-tolerated], but, like, faster.” I’m surprised that particular aspect of the side effect profile comes into play with acute usage.
Ah, yes, this happens a lot. No, I don’t work in the medical field at all. I just know things, for reasons.
i.e. the psychosis has done so much cumulative damage at this point that you need to fall back to the typicals. That explains why the third-gens are useless.
On a different note, have you heard about Cobenfy yet?
https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2024/09/27/g-s1-25089/karxt-cobenfy-schizophrenia-psychosis-fda
It obviously isn’t suited to the needs of your practice. But I’m really glad we’re making progress on alternative treatment approaches, especially novel ones like anti-muscarinics.
Hopefully the new glutamatergics can reach your setting soon.
Well obvs. It’s basically,“idk which receptor is making them _____ (punch people, refuse to eat or drink, or whatever other immediate harm to themselves / others), but we need it to stop 3 days ago and can figure out the details or a potential cross-taper to something better later.”
Color me fascinated, lol. My guesses are personal experience / reading up on your own treatment or that of a loved one, tangential relation to the field such as clinical research, or just plain personal fascination. Given you linked to a drug that appears to be in trials my first guess is actually the second one. Hadn’t heard of it, and I’m hopeful, but after seeing abilify get approved for acute agitation I’m… skeptical.
Yeah a lot of people don’t realize the damage is additive, both people w/ these disorders and unrelated laypeople who think “talented artist stops taking their meds and continues to be talented but starts creating art with weirder subject matter as their brain boils” is a cool story.
I’m mostly replying to add though that risperdal also has the distinction of being avaliable as a long-acting injectable, and if you’re trialing oral meds before committing to an LAI, your options are somewhat narrowed. Zyprexa does have an LAI available, but I’ve actually never seen it used and while I can’t tell you why for certain, I do have a guess.
If you have a patient sick enough that you’re considering an LAI, you don’t want to take benzos off the table for an entire month, especially if it turns out to be inadequate after discharge and they wind up in an ED agitated and unable to report their own med hx and get B52ed and stop breathing. I’ve had a pharmacist tell me considering that interaction is going out of style but a history of that kind of adverse event is difficult for a med to shake. Accutane still has suicidal ideation in adolescents listed as a side effect but I have a strong suspicion that it’s less causation and more correlation with the impact of pizza face on the self and social esteem of a teenager.